My Sister's Keeper -Response

Ksenija,
You were and are missed! I think you lived in a particularly cool area of Tucson, perhaps this is just a temporary place while you figure out a sweet place for you to actually enjoy living in. I have videos on my flickr account. We'll have to do one just for Joe.

I read the book last night in one foul swoop. While it kept me reading, I must admit I felt very much the same as you with regard to the Hollywood nature of the story line and the inclusion of the Campbell/Julia thing. I wasn't surprised by the Kate request of Anna to let her die, nor by the epilepsy. Although now you mention it, I doubt that with the sort of seizure history that Campbell had he would have been allowed to drive. I used to have to get my neurologist to sign off on my driving every year for years after my seizures. So that doesn't make sense that he would be driving legally. We discussed the lack of voice that Kate has in the narrative other than at the beginning. How Anna's narrative was much more mature, not realistic for a 13 year old, than her talking.

I agree about Sara. I think it would be easy to become tunnel visioned about the one sick child in that situation and it rather seemed like a slippery rock, once they were willing to conceive for the cord blood, which I could definitely see doing, it was just one poke here, one poke there, one procedure and then another until they or at least she couldn't see the difference.

What was the deal with Jesse and the arson? I was sure his homeless buddy was going to turn him in. It seemed like the partial development of another story.

"Why is it that no one ever gave up on Kate, yet they let Anna go so fast? How were they sure that they couldn't do anything for her?"
It was more cut and dry? It wasn't their decision, but Campbell's?

It was Bridget, Erin, Annalise (spelling?) and myself with our respective children.

Hi, everyone. I really wish I were there to discuss this book. We also miss you all, and Joe misses his playmates. He hasn't played with any kids in weeks. As for Tacoma, it's great, but I don't like our neighborhood, and I think I've been really spoiled by Tucson.

But back to the book. The entire time I was reading it, I thought, how bookseller-ish, how Hollywood-ish, yet I couldn't pull myself away from it. I finished late Thursday night (in a tent at the beach), and all day yesterday I thought of nothing else. I felt cheated by the ending. Apparently, her 12-year old son was angry at her about the ending. I can see why. I felt cheated in a similar way when I was reading Atonement. I felt emotionally manipulated. But then, again, I suppose that crazier things happen in life.

The main reason I would really like to discuss the book with you is the character of Sara. I did not like her. I thought she was a bad parent to Jesse and Anna, I thought it would have made so much more sense if she had let Kate go. But then I looked at Joe and asked myself if I could let him go in a similar situation. And I guess I couldn't. 

The funny thing is that I think I've been a better parent these past few days, as I've been reading the book. 

I guess the big dilemma is: would I have a child just for the purpose of trying to heal another one? I don't think so. 

Other thoughts:

- I thought the side story of Campbell and Julia was unnecessary, though I admit I was dying to find out what his ailment was. 

- I should have seen that ending coming, but I totally didn't. Had I paid more attention, I would have noticed that the italics in the introduction didn't match anyone's font, so it had to be Kate saying she didn't kill her sister. I also didn't see it coming that Kate asked Anna to kill her. Did you? I kept wondering why that girl (Anna) is so contradictory, and why her actions didn't make sense. 

- I enjoyed Jesse's character, though I thought it a bit of a stretch that he becomes a cop in the end.

- I really wanted Anna to live. 

- Why is it that no one ever gave up on Kate, yet they let Anna go so fast? How were they sure that they couldn't do anything for her?

- Is it a coincidence that Campbell is in two car accidents in the book? How come no one says whose fault the accident was?

So, anyway, none of my thoughts are very deep. Mostly I am interested in what you all thought about Sara, and about the ending. 

ksenija

Next book club!

Hey gals!

Next book club is at my house next Saturday at 3pm. I'll send out a reminder e-mail with my address etc. Here are a few questions I found to ponder about the book....

1) While Vivi was not a perfect mother, Wells does not blame her as a mother. Discuss the concept of the "good enough" mother and what acceptance of that concept means to a woman's acceptance of self.

2) One of the themes of the novel is the necessity of and the difficulty of personal growth. For instance, Sidda must remind herself and be reminded that she is a "grown up." Which characters in the novel experience personal growth? What obstacles must those characters overcome in order to grow? How do those characters that grow overcome the obstacles that stand in their way?

3)Vivi is a tangled, charismatic, and haunted character. How much does the culture Vivi grew up in influence her? Does a woman face special problems when she grows up in the South during the 1940's? Look closely at Margaret Mitchell's Gone with the Wind to see how it influenced Vivi's idea of who she was. In what way might "being a lady" pose problems for Vivi, her friends, and their daughters?

The latest book club

I think by now we have a steady group in the book club, and, except for Molly, everyone else was at Rachel's on Saturday, but I will write a brief account of what we talked about on Saturday anyway, if anyone cares to read. I just want to say that despite the gloomy topic, I had the best time, as did Joseph. It's great to get to know all of you I hadn't known before, and for the kids to get to know each other.  Who was there: Rachel and Ila (of course), Kelley and Evie (in an awesome Mexican dress), Analisa and Asher, Erin and Santiago (in a Che onesie), Bridget and Edie, Carrie (did I spell this right?) sans child, and Joe and myself. 

As for the book, we tried to draw the line between fact and fiction, but of course could not do that. There is not much info on the Internet, either. I found one site interesting:

http://www.vermontwoman.com/articles/1206/mirabal_sisters.shtml

I guess Julia Alvarez, Dede, and Minou visited this college, so the story is about all three of them.

We also discussed Dede: I initially thought she wasn't much of a heroine, but the others convinced me otherwise, pointing out how hard it must have been to be the one left behind, and how it's not a small feat to raise all those children and keep the other sisters' story alive. We talked about the other sisters. We all were partial toward Minerva, though, having children of our own, we were not as sure as we probably would have been at age 20 that we would join the revolution as easily anymore. Patria, we thought, was the sister who grew the most, and Mate was interesting, because it felt like her heart was never fully in it, that she did it for the love of Minerva and her husband, at least partly. 

We wondered if their deaths could have been avoided. This book actually reminded me of the Chronicle of Death Foretold by Marquez: you know from the start what's going to happen, but you keep hoping it's going to change anyhow. So although I knew they were going to die on that pass, I kept seeing all the ways they could have gotten out. But of course, as Erin pointed out, it wasn't a matter of if, but only of when. I also read that their murders finally galvanized the people, and Trujillo was overthrown later that year, I think.

Is there anything else that someone wants to add? The discussion actually went on for a while, interspersed with the usual conversations about children, so I am sure we talked about a lot more, but I can't remember right now.

In any case, we decided for a lighter reading for the month of June, and decided on The divine Secrets of the Ya-Ya Sisterhood. I am perhaps ashamed to say that this is one of my favorite books. Now, don't expect this one to be completely light either, but it definitely won't give you that doomed feeling that I had the entire time I was reading In the Time of the Butterflies. And, since I won't be here in June (flying to the motherland for Joseph to be spoiled by his grandparents), I hope you will be posting on the blog so I can vicariously participate.

Two quick thoughts

In the Time of the Butterflies creates characters out of women who really existed... does anyone know how the book was received by people who really knew the Miraval sisters and how much this parallels their actual lives?

Also for some reason thinking about both this book and the previous one really has me thinking about the role women play as "keepers" of religious faith for families and societies....

See y'all this Saturday!

Me again

So, how is it that we decided that The Bell Jar was too depressing and decided to read this instead? I am about 120 pages away from the end, and I don't want to continue (though I also don't want to put it down). 

Children's books

Julia Alvarez really  nice children's books. We have checked out two of her books. I don't know if she has more, but I really enjoyed them, and I am going to assume that Joe did too. Check them out.

totally unrelated

I know we only read books by and about women here, and you are all probably ahead of me and read this one already, but I am reading (listening to, but after years of internal struggle, I've decided that's the same thing) Little Children, and I just had to share with you how drawn by it I am. It's eerily making sense. I don't relate to any one character all of the time, but it feels like such a perfect book for people with little kids. Have you seen the movie? I haven't, but I am sure I will after I am done with the book. 

Eat, Pray, Love Discussion

The meeting was at Bridget's house on Saturday morning. Erin, Analisa, Rachel, Kelly, Ksenija, and Bridget were present. Here are some of our thoughts:

-Many people had different favorite and least favorite sections of the book. Kelly enjoyed India, Bridget stuggled through it. Others disliked Italy, but loved Bali and so on. We wondered if we were liking/disliking the stage she was at emotionally, the actual place, or how she traveled though each place and what she was doing.

-We discussed her decision to not have kids. We all agreed that it is a bad decision for people who do not want kids to go ahead and have them anyways. How about the decision to have kids? Is it the ultimate selfish act or selfless? We do know that a lot of the pieces that follow after having the kid are not selfish, i.e. changing diapers, up in the night, etc. Some felt that you become less selfish from having a kid.

-We all agreed that she is pretty self-absorbed....understatement of the year! While this did get tedious at times, that is also sort of the point of the book. She made these choices to have this certain life and now has a best seller. Good for her for making that happen. What is her original ex-husband thinking at this point?

-Her and Felipe: What is going to happen now? Will it last? Many of us want to read her next book just to know how it all unfolds. She sure had her life work out well for her. She went on this trip and fell in love with someone who gives her a sex injury? C'mon!

-Felipe's perspective on Wayan and the house: Some knew Wayan would try something sneaky all along. Others were naive up until the point where Felipe explains it to us. We thought his perspective was pretty insightful.

Overall, while we thought this book got a little preachy and self indulging at times, most were happy that we read it.

Suggestion for next book

I don't know if anyone has their heart set on something but I thought I'd toss an idea in the hopper for the next book...

On Beauty by Zadie Smith

1st section thoughts...

Sorry I haven’t weighed in sooner, I just stared the book last weekend because I HAD to finish the other book I was reading (Geographer’s Library, a really fun read by the way if you like DaVinci Code type books) My first impression of this book was that I was not going to like the author (aka main character) at all. She seemed very immature and selfish to me and not just a little bit shallow. (Sometimes it is great to be reading a book for a book group because it forces you to give the book more of a chance) I am glad I stuck with it though because as you move through the book you gain more of an understanding of her. I must admit I still don’t like her all that much, mostly because she is someone I really can’t relate to, but I do have a better appreciation for her situation and where she is coming from.

Quite frankly it is good to read the honest perspective of someone who really doesn’t want children in their 30s because I count myself among those that she refers to who just dove into parenthood without too much consideration for it. It just seemed like an awesome thing to do; an experience that I couldn’t imagine not having. I found her story about the artist new mother particularly striking. I think I had a similar night to this woman early on after Evie was born. What the author is missing, however, is that women who have children don’t necessarily know immediately how to best adapt their lives around their kids and can easily overdo it in those first few months (goodness knows I did). As a result their lives can look like misery in a snapshot when the truth is they are filled with joy AND constant adaptation trying to move back toward a new normal that includes many pre-kid activities but done in a different and oftentimes better way. So the author witnesses the scene but doesn’t have the right perspective on it in my opinion.

Her stories about Italy definitely make me want to travel again. (I was lamenting the other night that it has been more than two years… oh boo-hoo for me I know… since we have left the country for someplace other than Mexico) But I am not jealous per se, because I see the circumstances that have freed her to travel like she is and would not take that in a million years in exchange for a year of travel.

So on to India…

about the next book

So, I am listening to Eat, Pray, Love on CDs, which means that I can't use Post-it notes to mark the things I will want to discuss later. I am also too lazy to write things on a piece of paper. Therefore, I want to bring up a few things I'd like to discuss when we meet. I am still on the first part. We are still in Italy.

I wasn't initially too impressed with the book. The literary snob in me kept nagging about the writing. The word that kept coming up, though, was "self-indulgent." Do we really care, thought I, about another well-educated woman who is depressed because her life is not going who she planned? How hypocritical of me. I too had a few years of self-proclaimed hell, anti-depressants, the drama that enveloped me so completely, that it was the only thing that existed. So why then is it so hard for me to just relax and read about smart, pretty, successful women, instead of reading about starvation and serial rape? I don't know. What do you think?

I think she finally won me over when she quoted the country song that goes "I've been screwed, sued, and tattooed, but I am still standing here in front of you." So now I am mostly enjoying the ride. As a consequence of reading/listening to it, I am thinking that I need to rethink my relationship with pleasure (although I am not American, I think I have fully bought into the mentality she so well describes, which doesn't allow doing nothing), and especially with food. Maybe I can stop eating cereal for dinner out of plastic containers.

But, to shorten this long rant, my main question is this: how do you all feel about reading this book, knowing that, most likely, you will not be able to do anything similar to what she did, probably in the next 15 years? Are you envious? Am I envious? It's a whole different world that she talks about. And I can't even have lunch without Joe pulling on my legs to pick him up. Am I envious? I don't think so. But it sure is nice to fantasize about escaping to Rome for a few days.

And pictures, too

February report

Well, the most persistent of us met at Molly's and Perla's house, where we enjoyed the interior, awesome food, and conversation, while our children enjoyed each other. Who was there? Rachel, Kelly, Molly and myself, i.e. Ila, Genevieve, Perla, and Joseph. Joe was the only male around (if you are not counting David and James who were playing chess outside), and loved it: he kissed Perla and Ila, and Genevieve gave him a nice long hug. OK, OK, you are saying, but what about the book? Was the book discussed?

Yes, to an extent. Turns out only half of us finished the whole thing. Nevertheless, we discussed magical realism, the language of the book, the meaning of certain episodes. We all agreed that the book was over the top and hard to believe at times, even if it is supposed to be fantastical (the best example is the heroine's escape from an evil Duke via a model train located in a Faberge egg!). 

A thought about that: in my mind, tall tales are usually the product of men's imaginations. This may be the first example I've encountered, where a female author, and female protagonists (Fevvers and Lizzie, the latter being maybe my favorite character in the book), spin the craziest tales. 

We thought the male protagonist was weak. So much so that he let educated monkeys strip him of all his clothes, put a dunce hat on his head, and then examine his anatomy (Note: the monkeys may be, in my opinion, the most likable characters in the book). Was this deliberate? We don't know. If it is true that Fevvers is supposed to represent the "new woman," who bravely steps into the 20th century, then maybe Walser is supposed to be the new man, the one who will consent to being the consort. I don't know.

Along those lines, the big question was: is this a feminist novel or not? Some authors call it postfeminist (the term which I strongly dislike -- I have a postcard that says "I will be a postfeminist in postpatriarchy"), and criticize Angela Carter for crude language, I guess, though we couldn't figure out what the problem with  that was. 

However, I may have come up with one possible reason feminists criticize her: she glorifies prostitutes and prostitution in the first part, and it is the official feminist position, I believe, that prostitution is a violation of women's rights, and that no women willingly becomes a prostitute, nor enjoys it.

Anyway, to make a long story short, this is a wild ride of a book. The rest of the group liked the first part of the book (London) best, but I personally liked the second part (St. Petersburg). A lot of stories are ended violently, or are left unfinished, which Molly objected to. In any case, it's a good read. I am quite glad I got to read it. It's unlike anything I have read in a long time. The funniest thing is, I wasn't really aware this was a postmodernist novel until I was done.

So we meet again on APRIL 5. Kelly volunteered Bridget's house. We agreed that around 3 o'clock works best, because all the naps are done, and we end early enough for everyone to get to bed on time. We are reading EAT, PRAY, LOVE. Something a little more mainstream. I already got it from the library, so I can't wait to start. I hope to see you in larger numbers next time!

Essay on Night's at the Circus

Here is a link to an essay on our Feb book by a professor at CSU Long Beach.
http://www.csulb.edu/~bhfinney/AngelaCarter.html

Annie: Loved the Book Wished I Were at the First Meeting

I am also bummed that I missed the first book club. I read a Handmaid's Tale last January (I found out I was pregnant while reading it - a bit odd and entertaining). I have been eager to talk with someone, anyone, about it and, of course, I missed it! Maxine and I were in REAL New Mexico with my husband (It is fun trying to get a photo of you and your daughter when no one is around to take it for you...).

Anyhow, I love the idea of the ending. Allowing us to decide for ourselves what happened. I also hate it. I love closure and I acknowledge that is the lazy side of me. I am sure everyone is CERTAIN the ending is one way or another. Was there any consensus as to whether Nick saved her or betrayed her?

The relationship between Offred and the Captain's wife was pretty discouraging, as well. The wife worked hard to appear to have self respect and really didn't. She also seemed to accept the social structure (playing a large role in creating it) and tries to accept a system that requires her to allow a woman in her home to foster a child for her. Yet, she treats the potential mother of her child terribly- obviously uncomfortable with the situation and has no apparent control over it. Did you discuss whether you felt she regretted her role in creating this system? Was there any discussion on how a person gets to a place where they are comfortable taking another's child? Also, come to think of it, I had a problem with the weak, beaten-down woman being older and a former beauty and the protagonist being a younger, fertile beauty. It would have been more appealing to me if Atwood had not sent an over-used message about women being bitter and helplessly angry when they age and cannot offer their beauty or fertility anymore. I think it would have been more interesting if she had addressed how women deal with aging and their self worth, as well. (How many issues can we discuss in one book?!) Seriously, I would like more positive aging messages for women and perhaps this isn't the book but I feel it is important to say.

I also thought it was a shame that Offred's best friend and outward feminist ended up being "punished" in the book. However - maybe I am not remembering correctly - but I think that, if I had to choose, that is where I would have rather been (as opposed to Offred's or the wife's role). At least she could speak her mind more than Offred and have semi-normal female relationships.

The booze fridge and little New Mexico sound perfect. I work at the end of the town and look forward to the next club meeting!

Molly's 2-cent ramble, with asides

I'm sorry I missed the first meeting, but we finally got our kiddo to actually sleep (!) on a regular schedule and I didn't want to mess it up.

I thought Handmaid's Tale, while well written was quite grim. In contrast, I found Khaled Hosseini's A Thousand Splendid Suns, which I read for another book group and that dealt with Islamic fascism and wife abuse, to be beautiful and hopeful.

For me, the book is very much a part of its time: post Reagan, with both Andrea Dworkin and Phyllis Schafly increasingly prominent, and reading it reminded me of my bleak years at the end of highschool and first few years of university. At my school, feminism was a with us or against us deal. The more radical women mistook misandry for feminism; when they should have been having the time of their lives, they denied and repressed their sexuality. There wasn't much room for someone like me, who read Susie Bright and Kathy Acker. (After graduation, I bought a one-way ticket to San Francisco and felt much better.)

I read a lot of Margaret Atwood throughout my teens, although Handmaid's Tale is the first book of hers I've read in over 20 years. Many of her female narrators are very similar to Offred; they tend to be passive or introspective, wishing they could be more like their daring or radical friends. However, in defense of Offred, I think she was smart enough to know that it was best to be outwardly conformist (as one of the more educated women in Hosseini's book does). "He who hides well, lives well." (Descartes)

The men in Atwood's books are weasly and weak, unfortunately -- not a lot of strong men in her books. So, Nick was a surprise -- he's the hero (but maybe he rescues Offred only because she's pregnant?) but you never saw it coming. Two cheers for Nick for screwing them over from the inside. (Plus, it was easy to picture Aidan Quinn as him...)

As to whether it could happen here, I doubt it. But then I'm sure all the female educators and doctors in Afghanistan never thought they'd become criminals or be forced to operate in burqas. Years ago, I hired a guy to remove a tree stump -- a bonafide redneck who constantly opined on everything -- and I remember him saying "just you wait, when the revolution comes it'll be guys like me [heavily armed, southern, no nonsense] that'll fuck them over." So, if it does happen, let's hope he and his buddies can keep their word (and get their trucks to start).

I did like the ending; it seemed appropriate to have a symposium on what is (in our reality, as the reader) a theoretical society -- for a moment, I thought I was truly reading an afterward by independent scholars. It was a neat little trick.

As a Canadian I appreciated that there was a university in the great north: Nunavut wasn't officially declared a territory until 14 years after Handmaid's Tale was published; the Dene (Denay) are the first nations people in the area. Oh, and the "Particicution" was a play on a governmental fitness program popular when I was a kid called Participaction -- I laughed out loud, albeit inappropriately, when I read that scene since in phys ed, we often made fun of Participaction and its goofy theme song. Why does everything have a theme song?

::

I'm happy to host the next meeting (I'm all for whoever suggests the book host the event, just for variety). We live at Camino Seco and O.S.T. -- "practically New Mexico" as we've been told, so I won't be offended if it's deemed too far a journey for the majority. However, we have lots of room, lots of parking, and a booze fridge in the garage.

What we discussed

Here is a report from the very first meeting of the mama book club. We were sorry that some of you couldn't make it, but nonetheless had a great time. We even managed to stay on task about half the time, when we weren't discussing our children's eating and sleeping habits. I found it interesting that we posed a lot of questions about the book, and never fully answered any of them. I am hoping that we can continue the discussion here. Who was present? Kelly, Bridget and Edie, Rachel and Ila, Erin and Santiago and myself and Joe.

Some of the questions that came up:

Is this a feminist or antifeminist book? Yes, Margaret Atwood is a feminist, yet, the "old" feminists are not portrayed very well in the book, the main character is passive throughout her life, and her fierce friend Moira ends up a prostitute.

Why is the main character so passive? Is M. Atwood implying that we are all complacent in the atrocities that go on?

What happened at the end? Why did she choose to end the book that way? (We felt a bit let down by the ending)

 Why are the only female characters who are named Moira and Janine (and the aunts? Are those their real names?) Incidentally, apparently you can infer in the beginning that the narrator's name is June.

Any thoughts on this?

How plausible do you find this scenario? We found some obvious parallels to the U.S. in the recent years. Do you find the book hopeful or hopeless? We thought that it was hopeful: that no regime can keep people down forever.

Any other issues anyone wants to raise?

We have decided to meet again on February 23, and to read the book that Molly recommended: Night Circus by Angela Carter (whom I haven't read, so I look forward to reading her). Other recommendations for the near future: Reading Lolita in Teheran and Eat, Pray, Love. We haven't decided who will host the next meeting, but that will be easily decided. I can definitely host again.

Two more things: 1) Wikipedia has some nice information about The Handmaid's Tale, especially if you were confused by how Gilead is run (and why is it called Gilead anyway?) 2) Did you know that The Book Stop opened on 4th Ave, they have a great selection, and never any customers inside? So next time you are on 4th Ave, pay them a visit. Maybe they have Angela Carter books, too.

 

book review from 1986

The NYT review by Mary McCarthy is available online, and is a very interesting little time capsule (I wonder if McCarthy still avoids credit cards?):

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9A0DEEDC143DF93AA35751C0A960948260&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=all

(For those who aren't finished reading the book, beware that there are a few spoilers in the review.)

Strangely relevant...

Hey gals

I came across this article in the times last week and it seemed interesting and relevant to our current book choice (it actually even mentions the book):

http://warner.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/03/outsourced-wombs/index.html?ref=opinion

Looking forward to next week!

The inaugural post

Hello, literary mamas!

The inaugural meeting of the mom and baby book club will take place on Saturday, January 19. We are reading The Handmaid's Tale by Margaret Atwood. We will meet at our house. I will email you directions soon. In the meantime, I hope that you are making progress with the book. I flew through it. 

I thought that it may be nice to have discussions about the books here. I have never been in a book club before, so have obviously never moderated a book club meeting. Therefore, as I am struggling to come up with questions for discussion, I encourage you to start posting questions, thoughts, ideas, about The Handmaid's Tale, totalitarian societies, radical feminism, the choice of reading, the next book we should read, what kind of food I should prepare for our first meeting, how we will entertain 10+ small children while trying to do something intellectual...

Feel free to invite any of your friends (not necessarily moms) to join the blog, if they wish to do so. 

I look forward to meeting you all!